• MystikIncarnate@lemmy.ca
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    5 months ago

    I just want to talk at the fellas here. Man to man.

    If you do this shit, the women will leave and not come back. I know the incels are going to think that’s typical female behavior, and I’m here to say, no, it’s not. It’s typical for someone, of any gender, to want to exit a situation where they feel vulnerable, and that’s what is happening.

    Think of it like this: you end up in prison, and your naked, alone, you have no allies or friends, while taking a shower with about 100 other dudes, and Bubba comes over with a grin saying “you’re awful pretty”. How would you feel? I’m guessing you would want to nope the hell out of there and never take a shower with Bubba in the room, ever again. And that’s natural. You were in danger, you want to avoid that danger. While the circumstances might be different for the women you’re interacting with, that raw emotion, the exact same one you would have felt with Bubba talking about how pretty you are, the feeling that gave you, it’s exactly the same.

    Now think, after Bubba made such a statement, what could Bubba do to win your trust to shower next to them again at all? Probably not much. Same deal fellas. There’s little to nothing you can do or say to make them feel comfortable being around you when you’ve done something that inspires that unsafe feeling of danger.

    Now, how could Bubba avoid the situation of you feeling like you’re in danger and wanting to get out of there. A reassurance? Like Bubba instead saying “don’t worry, I’ll protect you”… You’re going to wonder “from what?” Because until Bubba spoke up, you had no feeling of danger. How does that make you feel? Well, I would feel like there’s danger that Bubba knows about that I don’t, so now I’m on edge, looking for what Bubba is talking about, and all of a sudden, I’m having the same feeling of danger, just this time from an unknown assailant. That’s not good either. I’d still want to gtfo and not go back. Worse now since I don’t know what the danger actually is. Not only would I not want to shower with Bubba nearby like in the previous scenario, but now I don’t want to be left alone with anyone.

    Same deal fellas. By trying to reassure the lady, you imply that there’s danger indirectly; she gets creeped out and leaves to not come back.

    So, what’s the right thing to do here?

    It’s easier than you think. Treat them like you would any of your male friends. Treat them like a person. You don’t need to reassure your male friends that you’ll protect them, nor do you feel the need to defend them when their “honor” is challenged. Let them handle it, but have their back if they need you… and only if they need you.

    Be a friend first, and if something happens that makes your relationship with that person, more than just friends, so much the better. Don’t expect it, women aren’t slot machines, where you put in enough tokens of niceness and eventually you win the sex jackpot. It doesn’t work that way. It never has, and it never will. You can’t force someone to like you, and if you try, you’ll either take any attraction that they might have had for you, and destroy it, and/or simply cause them to feel unsafe and creeped out, and they’ll find a way to exit and never return.

    People, regardless of gender, just want to do things they enjoy. If you also enjoy those things, then engage in the enjoyment of those things with the other people who enjoy them. Don’t make it about gender. If, beyond that, you both like eachother, you’ll find a way to spend more time together and that’s when things can grow to more than just being friendly, as long as you’re both agreeable to it.

    If you continually obsess over the fact that their anatomy is different, you’ll end up filling whatever negative ideas you have about the other gender, and push yourself so deep into a hole of confirmation bias that you may never recover. Just be people. Treat others the same, as people.

    I believe in you. You can do better. Always improving.

    You will fall, you will be rejected, you will have set backs. And that’s all normal. It’s a part of learning. You got this.

    • Nom Nom@lemm.ee
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      5 months ago

      This is some nice advice but

      Treat them like you would any of your male friends.

      Don’t do this. Understand that you wouldn’t do this with any random guy either. As with any new acquaintances everyone is cautious in the beginning and women more so. Whether you find the new girl appealing or not all you have to do is cautiously get to know her through your interactions with her, like any other relations you may build with initial strangers and get used to their presence and predilections.

      • Jank@literature.cafe
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        5 months ago

        You’re telling me not to rip a wicked funny fart and sock her hard in the shoulder when she’s too much of a panty waist to laugh? Pfsh.

        Some guys have no idea how to talk to chicks.

        • Nom Nom@lemm.ee
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          5 months ago

          SHHH!! Don’t say that shit out loud you’re gonna raise the competition.

    • noughtnaut@lemmy.world
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      5 months ago

      Thank you for this. You are eloquently and (hopefully) non-threateningly (is that even a word?) stating a message that really, really needs to be said again and again until everyone friggin’ gets it.

      • MystikIncarnate@lemmy.ca
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        5 months ago

        IMO, A nontrivial amount of blame goes to the fathers of such people.

        This shouldn’t imply that those who need to hear this are exempt from blame; they should have simply been educated by their parents on simple social etiquette…

        Of course, I’m also certain that a nontrivial number of those father’s actively encouraged such misbehavior.

    • Xanis@lemmy.world
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      5 months ago

      Trust is at its most basic a finite resource. Whenever a person messes up they recover by giving some of that trust away. Eventually that trust runs out. In rare cases you can regain some of it. However, in the vast majority of situations you’ll never get back all that trust lost.

      So spend wisely.

      Or rather don’t spend at all.

    • daltotron@lemmy.world
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      5 months ago

      Think of it like this: you end up in prison, and your naked, alone, you have no allies or friends, while taking a shower with about 100 other dudes, and Bubba comes over with a grin saying “you’re awful pretty”. How would you feel?

      Erect?

    • umbrella@lemmy.ml
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      5 months ago

      you mean treating women like humans, and letting it precede what your peepee wants? how preposterous.